Episode 158: What’s Possible with Dan

You are listening to the Overcome Pornography For Good podcast, episode 158, What’s Possible with Dan. 

Welcome to the Overcome Pornography For Good podcast where we take a research-based, trauma informed and results focused approach to quitting porn. This approach has been revolutionary and changed thousands and thousands of lives. I’m your host, Sara Brewer. 

Hey, everyone. I'm so excited for you to hear this interview with Dan. This is another episode in our What's Possible series. These are clients who have made great, incredible progress, quitting porn that just feel compelled to share their story to let other people know what's possible for them to give other people hope. And Dan has such an amazing story. So please, please enjoy.  And thanks Dan, thanks everyone who's done these What's Possible interviews. They really make a big difference. I get the best feedback on these. So enjoy this episode.

Sara: Hey everyone, welcome to today’s episode. Today I have Dan on with us for another What’s Possible interview. And I am thrilled and excited to introduce you to him. I’m really excited to hear all the details of his story. I know him, we’ve talked, we’ve done some coaching, but I haven’t heard all the details of the story because it’s mostly been through the group coaching that I’ve seen you. So anyways, Dan, do you want to introduce yourself and say hi? 

Dan: Absolutely. Yes, I’m Dan, I joined the program about a year ago. I started listening to the podcast a year and a half ago and am just thrilled to be here. And just as I’ve told Sara, assimilating this program and applying it to my life has just had a profound impact. And so it’s really an honor to be here. 

Sara: Yeah, thank you. I love these interviews because, I say this whenever we do these, but people will get on and you hear about people having success in all these other areas of their life that are maybe a little easier to talk about or share. And so what we don’t get too often is people telling their stories of how they quit porn. And we need more of those because if we don’t hear them, we start to think no one does it. It’s just something you have to struggle with forever. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: But there are lots of people that do. 

Dan: That’s so true. Yeah, because I started viewing porn when I was 15, partly by accident in a way. It was at a friend’s house and one thing led to another. And I’m mid-50s now. So this has been a four-decade journey for me and I’ve tried a lot of things. And this program changed my life, just the way of looking at it, the way of thinking, everything, shame-free, mindful, those things will change a person’s outlook, which then helps you quit. 

Sara: Yeah, awesome. Cool. Well, tell us a little bit what were your challenges for you in quitting porn before you started working in the program? And then if you want to tell us a little bit of your background or your story along with that. 

Dan: Okay. I would say I could boil it down to three things. First is just shame. Shame, shame, shame. I think I’ve said it before, it’s like heaping, steamy amounts of shame. Just like everything in my life revolved around shame on you, you’re a horrible person. The way that I saw myself was absolutely hampering my ability to see myself in a light that I could overcome. And so because of that, it was just a constant cycle, as you talk about. A shame cycle over and over. 

The second would be the use of willpower. You know the questions that go through your head, like why can’t you just make yourself quit this? Why can’t you be strong enough? And pushing that beach ball down doesn’t work. It’s like you get it underwater, as you’ve talked about, and you hold it and you hold it and you feel really strong. And then you just can’t, and it pops back up and you think, why isn’t this working? And it’s because willpower just doesn’t work. 

The third one is just a lack of transparency. I think once I told my story and started interacting with other people who have a similar story, or with people in the program, with my spouse, being transparent about my life made it less shame-inducing. 

And so those three things, because I was living a secret life, I was using willpower, and I was talking very negatively to myself with shame, I was not going to ever overcome porn doing that. 

Sara: Yeah, I love that. I love that you mentioned the lack of transparency and how vital that was for you. I think it’s Brene Brown, who I love and quote all the time. I think it’s her, she says shame thrives in darkness and it dissipates in light. 

Dan: That’s right. That’s right. It does, yeah. I even tried other programs that had phone filters, a variety of things to try and willpower through and sort of used an outside influence to make me be good. In my mind it was like, that’s how I’m going to overcome it. 

But then the transformational part is when you realize that doing the hard work of saying, why is this important to me from the inside out, like this is me deciding this. And not because I want to have a certain reputation or because I’m worried about hurting other people, but because of what it is I want from my life and porn wasn’t a part of that. 

And so rather than making it an outside, you know, someone else’s responsibility to help me be transformed, it became my responsibility. 

Sara: Yeah, really nice. Do you want to tell us a little bit of the background? So you said it started when you were 15 at your friend’s house. And like, how normal is that? That’s like so many people’s stories, but yet we don’t talk about it and so people feel horrible. But tell us a little bit about that. Tell us a little bit about your journey up until maybe a year and a half ago when you found these tools. 

Dan: Yeah, it started when I was young. I was part of a large family, a lot of kids. And so I think I grew up, it wasn’t – My parents are great, but when you have that many children, and there were eight of us, it was difficult, I think, to feel like you were seen in that environment. 

And so I was always looking for some place to belong and to be. And as you said, I went to a friend’s house and his uncle had a bunch of magazines there. And that’s where it started. Just hey, this is an escape from my reality, now what I would call a buffer. This is a way to get away from it all. And at the time, I didn’t really even know that intellectually. 

Sara: Yeah, you don’t have the awareness. 

Dan: Right, but that’s where it started. And then it became such a dopamine habit. That’s when, again, the program really helps because it defines the things that you look back on. You say, yep, this is exactly what was happening to me. And I didn’t even realize it because you get this dopamine habit going in your life where you turn to that every time something’s emotional or something’s not going well. 

And I come from a conservative Christian background, I served in ministry for a long period of time. I work in the financial industry now. But I’m really, you know, throughout all of my life I’ve had periods where I’m not using for a long time, you know, willpower. Just my sheer desire to not do this allowed me to have seasons where I wasn’t. But it was never with that intrinsic confidence that I have overcome pornography like I have today. 

And so my story, ultimately, I am divorced. I’m married again and I thought that even that new relationship would solve the problem, right? It’s like, okay, this new, fresh relationship is going to infuse what I need to never go back to this. And that worked for a while. But unfortunately, again, it wasn’t me. It was me using an outside influence to say, okay, that influence is going to make the difference. 

And so some really challenging things happened in my work life where I went back to porn use and then finally opened up, became transparent to my spouse, and that was also a year and a half ago. And it was devastating. I mean, and I will say this, I think for those of us who have the habit of using porn, a lot of times I think when we talk to our spouse, it’s not the porn use that’s really hurtful. It’s the lying and the deception that was going on. 

Sara: Yes. 

Dan: And that’s how my wife felt and is still, I’m sure, working through that. But it was also a profound new beginning because I started praying earnestly, okay, I need tools to help me this time to not go back to this. And lo and behold, I mean it’s an answer to prayer, in my opinion. Maybe it’s just Facebook stalking me, I don’t know, but it really was your program that popped up on my Facebook in an ad. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: And I started listening to the podcast when I would go on walks. And my dogs can tell you, I became a Sara Brewer fan right away because I would say things out loud to them like, oh man, she gets it. Like this podcast reveals that there is hope and you can drop the shame and take this one step at a time, one module at a time and just work on it. And ultimately, you won’t have the same responses when those triggers hit in your life that you used to have. 

So anyway, that’s a lot, but that’s kind of my story. 

Sara: So good. Yeah, thank you. And thank you for sharing about the disclosure that can be really painful and hard and difficult and also a new beginning, like you shared. 

Dan: That’s right. That’s right. 

Sara: Beautiful. That’s really beautiful. One thing I really – Oh, this is so random. This is off topic, but it’s something that I’m thinking about and planning and really trying to figure out how and when we’re going to do this. But I want to have a sister program for the spouses that might be going through some tough stuff because it’s such a different ballgame, right? 

When we’re talking and I’m sharing all the tools to quit porn, it’s very individualized to the person struggling with porn. But if we’re looking at the whole relationship, there’s a lot more. And a spouse might listen to some of the stuff I share and be really triggered by it. And they have the right and that’s valid because of maybe some of the, you know, whatever dynamics are happening behind the scenes and the betrayal that they feel. So anyways, thank you for sharing that. 

Dan: Absolutely. 

Sara: And there is a lot of hope. 

Dan: There is. There is. And I think it still requires a lot of work. I compare it to a train. I have to be the engine, I have to have the power to move down the tracks. But this program provides the tracks. You have a track to run on, but you still have to be the one to get up every day and make commitments and do the work. And I don’t mean every day because I didn’t do that, but I think just on a consistent basis.

Sara: Yeah. Thanks for clarifying that too, and that comes with that all or nothing thinking that you get a lot with porn. It’s like every day, we’re fighting this every day and that’s exhausting. 

Dan: Right, right. 

Sara: And it doesn’t have to be every day. It’s just consistency, whatever that looks like for you. 

Dan: That’s right. That’s right because there have been times where I go a month without really doing a lot, but then I’ll go a week where it’s just an hour a day. So, yeah, it really is truly an individualized journey, I think. 

Sara: And it’s really nice too, everything that you do, the skills that you learn are making you better and learning more, even more than we maybe realize. Like even at a subconscious level is how I like to think about it, where it’s doing more than we even realize and it’s not every single day that we just have to fight, fight, fight, fight. It’s going to be easier. 

So tell us a little bit about this work, how this work has changed you and some transformations, some breakthroughs that you’ve experienced the last year and a half. 

Dan: Excellent. So I would start with just the word grounded. One of the main things that has happened is the engagement of my senses when I’m feeling things and going back to my thoughts, processing those urges by – Like I’ll invite that emotion in and say, well, that’s interesting. I guess you’re going to be with me here. 

And you train that, Kat has talked to me about that in a coaching call, Jessica, it’s just been really rich to be reinforced in the program on coaching calls with the idea of, it’s okay for this emotion to be there. But then we also want to know why it’s there and then spend some time analyzing the thoughts that are influencing that feeling. 

And so I think now that has become such a regular part of my practice in life to use the model, to go through it, which is, of course, the circumstance, thoughts, feelings, actions and then results. And by using that model every day in my work life, in my family life, when it comes to porn, anything, it’s transformational on so many levels besides just the porn. Like it goes way beyond it. 

Sara: It’s this emotional – I don’t know, what would you call it? Like emotional maturity? But I don’t know if I love that word because, I don’t know, it sounds a little condescending. Like not emotional maturity, but just awareness, like knowledge that really goes into every area. It’s about so much more than porn. 

Dan: Right, exactly. I think you talk about being online and offline. And I can truly say prior to the program, I was living a lot of my life offline. You know what I mean? 

Sara: Yeah, right. 

Dan: It’s like this helps you get online because now you’re thinking about what’s really happening and how I can impact it or how I can change it for myself. And so that’s awesome. 

Sara: Yeah, that’s awesome. So did you do one on one coaching or did you just join all the different coaching calls with the different coaches? 

Dan: Just all the different coaching calls. I haven’t done one-on-one coaching yet. 

Sara: Which I love. I love that we get a mix of people. You don’t have to. You don’t have to be wildly successful. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: If you want that extra support, you can have it. But we’ve really tried to build it in that you get all the support you need even if you don’t do that. And Kat and Jessica are so good at the grounding, too. They’re really good at that. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: Did they teach you or did you do any specific grounding exercises that helped you? Or was it just awareness and the model? 

Dan: Mostly awareness. I think you encouraged me, and Kat both encouraged me to do some inner child work. I remember one of the coaching calls when you said, yeah, you’re going to have a lot of fun with that. And it has been. I think, for me, that may lead me down a path of maybe even some therapy at some point that would be healthy, you know? 

But there’s so many things we can do to be grounded. But then also, I would say how the work has changed me is also just seeing the goodness of the process rather than feeling like I have to arrive. Part of the problem for me, Sara, is that I would think I shouldn’t be tempted anymore or why am I having these thoughts about this attractive woman, right? Because I’m supposed to be transforming myself and not having these thoughts. 

Well, that’s so false. It’s not that people aren’t attractive in the world. It’s that I get to think about how I’m going to think about them, right? And change that. 

Sara: Yeah, and how you’re going to think about the thoughts that you have initially about them. 

Dan: That’s right. That’s right because a person can’t help the fact that they’re attractive and they came across your path. That’s not their fault. And you were made to be attracted to that. So that’s not, there’s nothing wrong with that. It’s stopping, dropping, breathing, sort of saying, okay, this is when you can go down this path of thoughts, right? 

So having that momentary stop, drop and breathe that I think you talk about in the podcast too on an episode, that is just so powerful to give yourself long enough to pause to get you on the model and then see where those thoughts are coming from and change the thought. 

So yeah, that’s huge. It’s just huge. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: I think about even for those who may be biblically minded, like my background has a lot of Bible involved in it. So I think about the creation story and how we think about God as being one who could do anything with a word, right? I mean, you just speak a word and anything could happen. 

So then why didn’t he create the world in one word? Well, he did it in seven days. Six days, actually, I guess, according to the story. But it was like every day he’s stopping and saying, this is good. This is good. And I’m like, okay, maybe there’s something to that. No matter what it is that we’re trying to overcome or improve or do, it’s like this is not going to happen overnight and maybe it’s not supposed to. 

Maybe part of the journey is to stop and say, hey, Dan, that was good, and now we get to move on to day two, right? So anyway, that to me was a transformational moment that just hit me like, yeah, it’s not all or nothing. It is truly, even God, who’s perfect, took things in steps and we can too. 

Sara: I love that, like the power in the process and the experience of it all. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: And I feel like that’s why we’re here, it’s to experience the process and not just, we’re good, we’re fine, we’re great at everything, we’re quitting porn. And that can be really hard, especially something so painful as pornography and pornography use that people can say, well, why would God want me to slowly overcome this? Wouldn’t God want me to just quickly quit it? 

Dan: Yes. And even the shame that sometimes comes from the religious community of if you really had the spirit of God, you wouldn’t ever do that again. Like it’s almost like it’s supposed to be this immediate thing that happens. And maybe that does for some people, Sara. I’m not saying it doesn’t. But for me, no way. Like that, not even close. And all it did was, yeah, make me feel worse, honestly. 

Sara: Yeah. And sometimes, right, the underlying message of that is if you were more spiritual, if you were closer to God, if you were a better, more spiritual person, he would take it from you. 

Dan: Right. Right. And that was not my experience at all. And so having a program where I could sit and say, okay, God, you’re on this journey with me and you see me. You know I’m improving and you know I’m doing better. And it’s just fun to celebrate instead of beating yourself up, honestly. I mean that’s just, that is so much the key for me, is celebrating the wins. 

And again, you taught me that. Like through the program, every single coaching call, what are the wins today? When we’d do a support group with Quinn, what was the win? Not, oh, what are you struggling with? I mean, we get to that, but it starts with what are your wins? And I just love that. 

Sara: Yeah, we really drilled that into everyone’s heads for a while. Like wins, wins, wins, wins. If we start with that, it creates more of it. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: It’s like gratitude, when we’re grateful, we find more things to be grateful for. We create more gratitude in our life. If we start with those wins and the celebrations, we’re going to create more of that than if we’re only focusing on what’s wrong. 

Dan: That’s right. Yep, so true. So I would say as far as how the work has changed me, those would be two big ways. I mean, in addition to, of course, just the daily models that I don’t – There are occasions now that I write them down, but most of the time it’s just something I do on the fly in a circumstance. It’s like that’s becoming a habit, which is really refreshing. It took some work, but it’s becoming a habit now. 

Sara: That’s awesome. That’s such a really great sign that those neural pathways in your brain are changing and it’s becoming a lot quicker and a lot easier to do these things that, you know, the model, the stop, drop and breathe, that first one. Did you find this, I’m curious, like when you first started doing it, did it take a lot more effort than now? 

Dan: Yes. With the model, I had to get out a pen and make myself focus on it for a few minutes and write it out. And then over time, I think it probably took me, oh my goodness, six months before it just sort of became this more automatic thing that’s happening now. And that may be different, again, for other people. Whatever the time frame is, is fine. But I just feel like it’s worth it. Like stop for a second and write it out because it’ll really transform the way you think about a situation. 

Sara: Awesome. Okay, I have another question about how you did the program, just as I’m looking at it and really trying to make sure that it’s as effective as possible. Did you go through the milestones? Did you do all of the milestones? Did you go through all the videos? What was the most helpful with you, like program content wise? This is kind of a selfish question for me. 

Dan: No, that was great. I did. I started out by watching everything in the program except the replay coaching calls because there’s just so many of them. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: But all of the program content, I went through it systematically. I can’t remember now if I necessarily did them in order. I would sit down at the computer and go, okay, which one sounds interesting to me today? And then play it. 

And I would usually do the entire, all of the videos in one milestone all at once. Like I know it’s a lot, but then what it did is it allowed me to go back into the workbook and I printed it and I would use it on paper. I’m kind of old fashioned, I guess. I just love the paper and the pen over the typing. But it was great because then I could go through the worksheets on my own time and schedule. But I sort of had the entire milestone in my head at that point from all of the videos. 

Yeah, and will say, I mean, for me, the urges one was first. I had to get that really before my head was clear enough to do other things. And then it went into the big one, big, big, big one for me is beliefs and identity. Just changing how I see myself, especially that one worksheet about things I – This isn’t the way it’s worded, but it’s basically things I like about myself. You have no idea how brutal that was. I’m like, oh, do I like anything about myself? 

Sara: I think I remember you bringing that up at a call once. 

Dan: Yeah, yeah. 

Sara: I think I remember you saying that was really hard. Yeah. 

Dan: Yes. Yeah. But it was so good. And then just being able to hop on and watch a coaching call because it’s amazing when other people bring up what their questions are or what maybe a struggle is, it’s always relevant. I mean, no matter how far I go into the program I’m like, oh, I can’t wait to listen to another coaching call, because even if I’m in a different place today than I was a year ago with my journey, I still look back on things and go, oh, well, there’s something I didn’t think about before as you all are doing the coaching. 

And one other thing I will say too, the podcast roadmap that you’re sending out is really powerful, I think. I listened to the podcast in order one episode at a time. I started out one a day and that continued for a very long time until I ran out of episodes. And then I had to cut back to once a week because I had to wait for you to release a new one. 

But it was great and what really stood out to me were the four pillars, because if anyone’s listening through the podcast, that would be something you could do too, is like look at, at least for me it worked to do the shame-free commitment, the mindful urge management, emotional regulation, and then becoming a new person. It’s like that’s exactly what happens, I think, over time. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: And you have to give yourself permission to let that time be what it is for you. But those are still the pillars. I thought those four episodes were really powerful. 

Sara: Yeah. Nice, thank you. Yeah. Thanks for sharing that with me and with everyone else. Okay, awesome. Okay, anything you want to add on – Let’s see, I’m looking at this other question. How have your relationships, life and your impact all grown as a result of the work you’ve done? 

Dan: First of all, I don’t see myself in a negative light as much because of the work of the program. And porn had a lot to do with that because I had so much shame around the habit of porn. And so once that becomes something that I’m empowered to overcome, then it’s like, well, why not in these other areas as well? 

Including I feel like being more present for my wife and less offended by her when she says no or says this isn’t working for me. I don’t get offended and think, hey, I got to go into my own offline state here to get through this. I can go into the mindset of being present and really getting to love and know someone in a way that’s been difficult for me in my life because of my porn habit. 

And I’m telling you guys, I probably get emotional because it’s so powerful. Like really learning to – Sticking with the program and doing the work, no matter how long it takes, to be able to say, wow, I’m really starting to see what it’s like to be in a relationship with someone where it’s fully transparent and we see each other. And that’s only going to get better with time. So I’m really excited about that. 

Sara: Well, and once you learn how to sit with yourself in emotion, in negative emotion and hard emotion, that’s when you can do that with other people. 

Dan: That’s right. 

Sara: Like if I can just sit with you in whatever it is you’re bringing to me without going offline and getting triggered and all the things, if I’m comfortable-ish with negative emotion that you’re bringing me, that’s when it can get real, like relationships can get really deep. 

Dan: Absolutely. That’s right. In fact, I would say to that, my emotions have become my friends. I love that you reference the movie Inside Out and also the book, the children’s book, I can’t remember what it’s called, but about the bears or whatever. 

Sara: Going on a bear hunt. 

Dan: Yeah, going on a bear hunt, because that’s so true also. I mean, like Kat is the one who, she just made me laugh because the one time during coaching, she was like, yeah, just tell that emotion that, okay, you’re here, you’re going to be my friend for the day. That’s okay. And I think you’ve said it, too. 

But I never looked at life that way. I always thought, oh, I hate this emotion, I’ve got to fight it. I need to push it away. I need to try to get over it. And instead of that, it’s like, no, it’s actually pretty rewarding to just embrace it and say, okay, this is what we’re doing right now. And so, yeah, that’s been a big deal with relationships, too, absolutely. 

Sara: Yeah. Awesome. Anything else that you want to add from – 

Dab: Oh boy, man, I tell you what, so many things. I mean, just thinking through the fact that being in the program isn’t a limited time access. I cannot think of any better investment of money. And really even a better investment of time because even as this process of overcoming for me is becoming what it is, like where I can say I’ve overcome pornography, that doesn’t mean that I don’t still want community and growth and a time to listen and to talk with other people. 

And I’m telling you, I don’t know what inspired you to make this program like you did, but thank you, sincerely. It’s huge to be able to know, hey, I can hop on and be a part of this anytime that I need it as I go forward. So I love that. 

Sara: Thank you. A big motivator with that was just getting rid of all the barriers we can around the all or nothing thinking. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: And so, right, like okay, I’ve joined this program, I’ve got a year, immediate pressure. Immediate pressure, which will immediately make it harder. And so we can just – And also I think part of it comes from a place of like, I know I’m always going to be adding things and making it better. And so I want people to have access to whatever. Like as I grow, I want other people to just have that. 

Dan: Yes. Well, and I think it’s led to other things, too. And I know now, you have a, even from a business side, you have a very loyal client who’s going to be here forever. So I would say it’s just wonderful for everybody. 

Sara: Yeah, thank you. Okay, I know you already answered this a bit, but is there anything you want to add to this question? What do you think is possible for you now as a result of you quitting porn? Because you had mentioned at the beginning, you said, I never felt like I could say I’d overcome porn, but now I feel like I can. 

Dan: Yes. 

Sara: And can you tell us what that means and what that looks like?  

Dan: Yes. It doesn’t mean that I’m not still a man with eyes, right? It’s not that I’m not in the world anymore. And it’s not that I’m impervious to thoughts that come into my head. Overcoming doesn’t mean perfection. It means that you have the tools and you’re using the tools. I think, implementing what you have to make choices that align more with who you want to be. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: That’s what overcoming is about, to me. It’s not, again, it’s not all or nothing. It’s more, no, I really don’t want this anymore. I mean, it’s because I have chosen this. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: Yeah, right. 

Sara: That’s so good. Thank you for sharing that, because that’s something – I don’t know if you’ve heard me talk about this a lot recently, but I’m like, oh, we need to change how we’re talking about overcoming porn for good. Because if we think about it like, oh, we know for sure we’re never going to slip up, we have no more temptation, that’s just not it and that’s not going to help us. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: And so I wanted to check in with you if you had kind of felt that. The idea here is we have the confidence that if we do have an urge, we know what to do. If we do slip up, we know what to do. And porn doesn’t have any more power over our lives anymore. 

Dan: Right. That’s right. Yeah, you are empowered versus thinking of it as, oh, this thing is so powerful and I can’t resist it. It’s not like that anymore. 

Sara: Yeah. Thank you.

Dan: So, yeah, it’s really awesome. 

Sara: Okay, what else? What do you think is possible for you now as a result of quitting? 

Dan: Well, okay, so my wife and I love to watch HGTV shows. We watch this one that’s called Help, I Wrecked My House. 

Sara: Okay. 

Dan: And it’s basically people who try to do remodeling projects and they don’t do horribly, but they tear things apart and they don’t know how to really get it put back together. And that show is like the perfect illustration of my life where this program provided the tools and the expertise that when implemented, I was able to then put this back together. And now it’s going to become every day, you know, each room of the house sort of becomes something more beautiful.

And I love that vision, at least in my head, of what happens on that show, because that way, in my mind anything’s possible. That’s what I would say, anything is possible. Obviously, there’s a lot of things that influence that. But I just truly believe that. The only limiting thing would be my own beliefs. And so I’m excited about continuing to grow in that. 

Sara: It’s like you do this, you overcome this thing that has been there for decades that you never thought you’d be able to, that has been all consuming. And then you overcome it and you’re like, oh my gosh, if I could do this with this, the sky’s the limit. 

Dan: It is. Right. Right. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: And I find myself being less timid, maybe is the word, at work. Just more confident about every area of life. And so, yeah, the sky’s the limit. 

Sara: Yeah, cool. And you can use these tools now for whatever it is that you want to work on. It’s the same stuff. 

Dan: Right. 

Sara: It’s the same, feeling the emotion, feeling the fear of failure, the fear of rejection, those things. If we can feel those feelings and we can be comfortable with those – What’s Brooke Castillo say? She says the price to success or the currency, what is it? Like discomfort is the currency of your dreams or something. 

Dan: Yes. Right. Yes. And I’ve always pictured it too, like when I was in the river of misery, as we talk about in the program, just having all those coaches like on the shore cheering you on. And yeah, I don’t know, it’s so different from the mentality of willpower. It’s just you feel accepted and like, okay, I’m not gross and disgusting. I’m just a person and of course I did that, let’s go forward now, right? So, yeah. 

Sara: Thank you. Okay, any other insights that if you think about someone is where you were a year and a half ago, or any other of our listeners, anything else that you might want to share with them before we close up? 

Dan: First and foremost I would say it is never too late. When I saw the first magazine at age 15 and all this stuff had unfolded in my life and then I heard Quinn’s story on a What’s Possible episode on the podcast, I remember thinking, man, anything is possible. I mean, he did this, I can do this. Like it’s you have all of these years of your life ahead of you. Even if you’ve been in this habit for a long, long time, start today. It’s just such a beautiful process and it’s never too late. 

Another one would be, and we talked about this, but do the milestones or listen to the podcast in a way that works for you. I think too many times people think that there’s a prescription and there’s really not. You have to just go at it from who you are and where you are and what you think is going to speak to you today and let the program unfold in your life one day at a time. 

Don’t feel pressure about it. That’s how I feel about it anyway. And just trust the process. Make friends with your emotions. You know, those things that we’ve already talked about. 

And finally, for me, I also have made friendships with, for me it’s men, four guys in my local community that I meet with for coffee. I talk to them. I am transparent with them because it was tough at first, almost as tough as being transparent with my wife. But I just felt like this is my story. The thing that gives it power is to feel shame about it. 

So while I’m not going to necessarily put up a billboard, I also think it was really important for me to have that transparency face to face with other guys. And surprisingly, a couple of them said, well, while we’re on the topic, because people are afraid to talk about it. And so it’s pretty cool, you bring it up and then the next thing you know, you’re really helping people. 

Sara: Don’t you think it’s probably the majority of people? 

Dan: Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think, I mean, I don’t want to be that guy who’s like, yeah, if they tell you no, they’re lying, because maybe there are people who aren’t. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: But I just know it’s such a common thing and we need to be more transparent about it. It takes the power away from it. 

Sara: Yeah. 

Dan: It really does. 

Sara: Yeah, and changing that narrative of what it means about someone. Like as you’re talking, I’m just thinking to myself, and hopefully I phrase this in an okay way. But the trust level that I would have for someone who has struggled with porn forever and then gone through this process, like I would trust them so much more than maybe someone who hasn’t done that work of the emotional stuff, of the like understanding the thoughts and the beliefs and just all the deep inner transformation. Like it makes you such a good person, you know? It’s like it’s a catalyst to learn these things that a lot of people might not ever get the chance or be pushed to learn and just stay in their comfort zone. 

Dan: That’s so true. And it impacts – Like even I lost 20 pounds over the last year. And again, I attribute that a lot to that model and what you’re thinking. You know what I mean? It’s just so transformational. So, yeah, I’m excited about what’s next. I don’t even know, I mean, it might be the same job, the same everything, but it’s going to be done and not the same way. 

Sara: That’s so good. 

Dan: You know what I mean? And that’s what’s so awesome about it, your whole circumstance may not change, but the way you’re thinking about it completely changes. 

Sara: Yeah. So good. Thank you so much. Thank you for coming on and sharing. Thanks for sharing your story and being here. Thank you, thank you, thank you. 

Dan: Well, thank you. And I can’t say it enough, I’m kind of by nature a hugger, so I wish I could go to the Sara Brewer staff and say, hey guys, thank you. I mean, just from the bottom of my heart, just for everything you do. And I know, I’m sure you make sacrifices and we just so appreciate that. Thank you. 

Sara: Yeah, thank you. We’ll send energetic hugs to everyone. 

Dan: All right, awesome. 

Sara: Yeah, thank you. All right, you guys. Thank you for being here and we will talk to you next week.

I want to invite you to come and listen to my free class, How To Overcome Pornography For Good Without Using Willpower. We talk about how to stop giving in to urges without pure willpower or relying on phone filters so that you can actually stop wanting pornography. 

We talk about how to stop giving up after a few weeks or months. And spoiler alert, the answer isn’t have more willpower. And then lastly, we talk about how to make a life without porn easily sustainable and permanent. 

If you’re trying to quit porn, this class is a game changer. So you can go and sign up at Sarabrewer.com/masterclass, and it is totally free.